Transcript 0:00 Hey, everyone. Welcome back to another episode of Melanin MVP. I'm your host, Angela Hollowell, and today I am joined by Doc Holliday Golden, who was actually referred to me by a previous podcast guest, Mary Fleming. 0:15 Doc, thank you for joining me today. My pleasure. Thanks for having me. 0:19 You and Mary are a lot alike in that you guys both have a beautiful wall of medals from all of your many triumphs as athletes, and I wanna ask, one, how did you and Mary meet? How did that happen? Sure. 0:33 Even just hearing the name Mary Fleming brings joy to me. Last year, I was assigned to be a pacer at the Every Woman's Marathon in Savannah, Georgia. It was the inaugural year of that race, so it was very exciting. 0:50 It was a sellout marathon, and when I got there the day before the event, I was told that my co-pacer was gonna be Mary Fleming. 0:59 I had no idea who she was, and then someone pointed her out, and I was like, "Oh, we're gonna be friends." Like, I could just tell by her countenance that this was gonna go well. 1:10 And we had the privilege of being co-pacers for Every Woman's Marathon in Savannah, Georgia, last November. I love that. I'm trying to go to the one this year that's gonna be in Arizona. Okay. 1:26 Not as a runner, please don't get excited. [laughs] I'm very excited. But more as a filmmaker and as a, I guess a reporter in some ways. 1:34 Wanna document what's happening there and why these women's marathons and half marathons keep popping up. I think that's a really amazing phenomenon. So- Mm-hmm... I'm excited. Hopefully, I will see you there this year. 1:45 I hate that I missed it in Savannah. Savannah's, like, one of my favorite cities in the South, so. It was nice. [laughs] You'll have a great time in Scottsdale. It's also fun. 1:55 So I wanna talk a little bit about your journey into running and being a triathlete and an ultramarathoner. These are not small feats. 2:03 Definitely not small enough that you could do them as many times as you've done them, as indicated by the medals on your wall. So what was that first step like for you? Did you grow up being an athlete? 2:15 Was it something you did on a whim as an adult? Talk me through that. Oh, great question. 2:21 I love talking about the beginnings because sometimes you see so much of what the present is, and it helps to connect with people on those beginning granular levels. And I grew up very active. 2:34 I, I did a bunch of different sports growing up. I did gymnastics for years. I played volleyball. I was on high school track and field. Nothing elite, but very active. 2:44 And then in college, again, active, but not on any team sport. And years later, in my early 30s, I had a coworker who was a marathoner. 2:56 [lips smack] Her name was Lane Paulson, and she was training for a marathon and then did the New York City Marathon. And she-- this is my friend. 3:07 She was a regular person, a regular woman, my friend, and she helped s- light the spark that got me into distance running. 3:17 And she encouraged me to sign up for a 10K, which I thought was, uh, just completely unreasonable. I was like, "How in the world could a human ever possibly run six miles? That's outrageous. 3:31 Surely my legs would break off, and I would die." And she just, she encouraged me, and literally, for two years was like, "Let's do it. We'll do it together. We'll take our time." 3:42 And after two years of encouragement, I was like, "Okay, let's try it out." 3:45 And again, I had done running in high school, but track and field, so you're not really ever running more than two miles at a time, and when we did run two miles, it felt like the end of the world. 3:58 And so she encouraged me to sign up for the 10K. I did that first 10K in June of 2010, and sh- we-- it was quite difficult, I will say. We trained it together. 4:11 It was quite difficult, but it was unbelievably rewarding, and I saw that it was possible. And I was like, "This is good." This was hard. I was surrounded by... 4:23 It was an all women's 10K, interestingly enough, and I felt very supported by the other women around me and by the volunteers, by the race staff, by the people who came out to cheer, and I had a great time. 4:36 I had a great time, my friend. And that escalated very quickly into signing up for a half marathon and then a full marathon, and then the rest is history. I think the rest is history is putting it mildly- Yes... 4:51 because I think [laughs] there has been much, much more to the story since then. Uh, you're an ultramarathoner, so that's, like, even longer than the 26.2, which such a small percent of people even do. 5:05 So you're talking about really long distances. We're talking about getting into triathlons, which is running, biking, and swimming, and we're talking about pacing other people. 5:15 We're talking about becoming a USA Triathlon certified coach. Like, we're talking about a lot that has happened- Yes... in 15 years, right? From this one 10K. Yeah. 5:25 So clearly, community and the rewarding feeling of completion were really big driving forces for you. How have you found that in other athletic competitions and races? The, like, motivation from the community? Yeah. 5:43 It's been incredible. It's something that I look forward to regularly in my life is getting, feeling that connection and community at a race or an event. 5:55 The beautiful thing about being a part of a team is that you feel that all the time 'Cause if you're training with people regularly and you do workouts, whether you run together, swim together, bike together, walk together, you feel that support, the motivation, that camaraderie. 6:12 It's interesting also, just going back to what you just said about what some of my next steps turned into. I never in my life considered being an ultramarathoner. 6:22 I didn't know about ultramarathons when I started doing marathons. Like, it, [laughs] you take- it takes time to find out about each level of craziness. 6:30 But s- getting into ultramarathon running and getting into triathlon and moving in the direction of becoming a certified USA Triathlon coach, 6:42 it was all about who I was surrounded by, 'cause I learned about these things from my peers. 6:48 I learned about them from people that I was running with, or that I was doing triathlon with, that there are next levels and there are other things to explore. 6:59 So that really matters, to be mindful of who you're surrounded by and what they're talking about. If you don't feel provoked by your friends, if you're not learning and growing as a result of your friends, 7:12 you need to do some exploration [laughs] and find some meetups. I always tell people, "If you wanna become an author, start hanging out with authors. If you want to do a marathon, meet some marathoners. Find them. 7:26 Look online. Go to clubs. Look at meetups." There's conversations, panel discussions in every possible topic and category, and friends with the people in the direction of where you want to go. 7:40 That feels like a snippet from a talk that you would have with a college or high school class, and I know that you are a speaker as well. 7:49 And I think that, yes, it is 1,000% important to be surrounded by the type of people that you want to become, but also the people that will push you to be better than you are currently, and maybe even push you to dream a little bit bigger than you originally had. 8:04 Talk to me about that transition from running and getting comfortable running long distances to trying out your first triathlon. Did you do the whole thing by yourself? Did you join a relay team? What was that like? 8:16 Great question. I love that you mentioned relay team. When I started doing triathlon, I didn't know that relay teams existed. 8:23 And for those listening, a triathlon is a multi-sport event, typically where you swim, bike, and run. And sometimes people can be a little bit nervous crossing that hurdle into doing three disciplines back to back. 8:37 But there is a thing called relay where you can have one person swim, one person bike, and one person run, which is a beautiful gateway into the sport. 8:47 I, like I said, did not know about relays, so I had seen Ironman on TV, and Ironman is... 8:56 The full distance Ironman is a 2.4-mile swim, 112-mile bike ride, and a 26.2-mile run, and it was just fascinating to see athletes compete in three disciplines at that level. 9:13 And I was interested in triathlon and Ironman, but certainly didn't know anyone. I was working at NYU. The student 9:23 and one of the coaches that I was working with at the gym was constantly talking about his triathletes, getting up at 4:00 a.m. 9:32 and crushing these workouts before they start their day, and just always bragging about these people. And I'm like, "Geez, okay. Maybe I need to step up my game." 9:41 So what I did first was volunteer at several triathlons just to see what it was about. Like, I didn't know anything about anything. I knew it was swim, bike, run, and that's it. I didn't know what a transition area was. 9:55 I didn't know anything about what you wear or what you eat or I didn't know what the distance is. 10:00 I just knew I need to go to a triathlon, see athletes, meet athletes, talk to people, talk to coaches, talk to spectators, and just absorb while I'm serving them. 10:12 'Cause th- when you sign up to volunteer, they're like, "What do you wanna do?" And I was like, "What do you need? I just wanna be around the athletes and help them however you want." 10:19 [laughs] So I volunteered for a couple of triathlons, met athletes, met coaches, learned a little bit, and I got an invitation afterwards saying, "Thank you so much for volunteering. 10:32 You have a guaranteed entry into next year's New York City Triathlon." And I thought to myself, "Oh, I got a spot. I wasn't going for a spot. I just wanted to volunteer." 10:42 [laughs] And because I got the spot, I was like, "I guess it's time. I must accept this beautiful offer." And I accepted it, and then once I paid the money... And it was a lot of money. Like, that was the thing. 10:57 I w- like, it was over $300, and I was like, "Yo." But I signed up 'cause I was like, "I wanna do this." 11:02 And one of the things that I noticed at the triathlon that, one of the ones I was volunteer- teering for, is that the athletes didn't look one way. 11:13 The athletes looked like, uh, you take a walk in New York City and you just see all kinds of people. There were tall people, short people, big people, small people, older people, younger people. 11:27 The, uh, it, it was, the, all kinds of people were there, and I... That was very inspiring to me that I was just like, oh, like you don't have to be a super athlete to do a triathlon. You don't have to be an Olympian. 11:41 You just have to be a human with the desire and the will, and then you can sort the rest out on the way. 11:49 So I sign up for the race, and then I started googling for local clubs, because I knew that I didn't know anything, and I knew that I needed to learn, and I needed accountability, and I needed motivation and people to train with. 12:04 So I looked up a bunch of clubs- And the one that I found that suited me best was Empire Triathlon Club, which I joined in 2015 and haven't left, and here we are in 2025. 12:18 So that's kinda how I got into triathlon, and once I joined the community, once I joined Empire Tri Club, I started to train with them and learn. 12:30 My plan was just to do one triathlon that year, the one that I had gotten into the previous year, and loved the community, loved the training, loved the race vibes, that before the year was out, I had done five triathlons, and it just... 12:48 One thing led to another. Like I said, it escalated quickly. When you're surrounded by a community and you're working towards the same goal, anything's possible. Okay. I have a couple of things here- Sure... 13:01 because I was actually gonna ask you about Empire Triathlon, because you're like their poster child on Instagram a little bit. [laughs] Thanks. So, like you're synonymous with this group now. 13:13 But I wanted to ask, one, what was the distance of your first triathlon? Did you go embark on a full Ironman, or did you do a half? Did you do a sprint? 13:23 And then when you said you did five, were they all five the same distance? And the reason I'm asking is because I'm trying to gauge, like, how you approached your entry into this. 13:33 Did you approach it as, let me try the same... Let me try five sprints, or let me try two sprints, and then two halves, and then a full? Did you try to titrate up? Right. 13:42 Did you just try to get comfortable with the sport, and learn your body, and learn how you train best? What are some things that you tried early on? 13:49 Because some people who may be interested may be considering these same things. Absolutely. Great questions. I love it. So the 13:57 race that I got into was an Olympic distance triathlon, so the swim for that was one mile, the bike was 25 or 26 miles, and the run was a 10K, six miles, 6.2. 14:11 So that was what I signed up for first, and when I joined the club, I learned that there was a thing called a sprint distance, which is a shorter one, and I was like, "This is great." 14:24 So I, [laughs] I was like, "Okay, let me sign up for the sprint tri," where the swim was 400 or 500 yards, the bike was 12 miles, and the run was a 5K, three miles, 3.1. 14:39 And so I signed up for that, and then I also, again, through the club, heard about an indoor triathlon. There's not many of them all over, but there are still several when you look around. 14:54 The YMCA sometimes puts on indoor triathlons, and th- so there was a, an indoor tri where you swim for 10 minutes in a pool. You just swim as many laps as you can in 10 minutes. 15:10 You get on a stationary bike, like at the gym. There was a gym there. You ride your bike for 30 minutes, and then you run for 20 minutes on a treadmill. And I was like, "This is great. This is very doable. 15:24 This is just like a big workout." But it was very non-threatening, non-intimidating at all, because it was in an indoor gym environment and very sh- short distances and times. 15:36 [smacks lips] So technically, that's what I ended up doing first, was the indoor tri, which was really about g- like letting your body taste what it feels like to go from discipline to discipline all at once, which was exciting and new. 15:54 And then I did the sprint tri and the Olympic, and so this is that same year, and then I did another sprint and another Olympic. So that first year was three sprints and two Olympics. 16:12 And then the next year, [sighs] I don't think I did a, a 70.3 Ironman yet. 16:20 So I think the first two years were sprints and Olympics, and then by the third year, I did my first 70.3 Ironman, which is a half of a full distance triathlon, 16:33 and it wasn't until my fourth year that I did the full distance Ironman. Okay. So there is a little bit of a progression here, and I was not aware that there was an Olympic triathlon or an indoor triathlon. 16:46 So that's good to know. We're learning new things. We're learning new lingo here. 16:50 [laughs] Which is helpful, 'cause a lot of people think that the most publicized triathlon is Ironman, and Ironman is a brand, not a distance. 17:00 Ironman is the brand that sponsors and puts on most of the 140.6-mile f- full triathlons. They put on the most of them. 17:10 So most people, when they're exposed to triathlon, are seeing the world championships in Kona on TV, which that's not [laughs] where you start. 17:19 So it is very helpful for people to know there's much smaller, shorter distance, doable triathlons, and you work your way up. I appreciate that. So where does running fit into all of this? 17:32 As you're training for these triathlons that are getting progressively longer, where does training for marathons fit into this? Where does exploring running an ultramarathon fit into this? 17:44 And how do you feel like that balance has shifted or evolved over your journey as a, as an athlete? It works together. 17:54 Like, it really can complement each other, m- marathon running and triathlon training, if you're able to balance it and the timing of your events properly. My first marathon was also the year of my first triathlon. 18:12 And they weren't, certainly weren't the same weekend, but in training for a marathon, it's very helpful to cross-train, which you can- swimming can be cross-training, cycling can be cross-training. 18:25 A lot of people feel that cycling makes your running stronger, so it works nicely. And so yeah, they really can complement each other. 18:37 With the ultramarathoning, once my buddy introduced me to it, and I want to share with everyone that when my friend, who is a fellow marathoner, said, "Hey, let's do an ultramarathon," and I was like, "I have no need, no interest. 18:53 Why are we doing this? What takes me long enough to run 26.2 miles?" And she was like, "It's beautiful." It was out in Arizona, that first one, and she also said it has a very generous time cutoff. 19:09 And I think the actual time cutoff for the distance was you had to average 20 minutes per mile. 19:17 And for people who are not really sure what that correlates to, a regular walking pace, like a middle-of-the-ground walking pace is three miles an hour, which is 20 minutes per mile. 19:30 If you're a New Yorker, you probably walk at a 16 or 17-minute mile pace, and if you are, let's just say, not a New Yorker, you might walk 22 or 24 minutes a mile. But 20 minutes is the average walking time. 19:47 And I was like... So what that meant to me was I can run as long as my body is able to run, and if needed, I can take walk breaks and run again. 19:59 Or if I got to a point where running, my body wasn't gonna run anymore, if I needed to walk the remaining two or three or four miles, I would have enough time because I was averaging faster than 20 minutes a mile for the first several miles. 20:15 And that made me feel safe. It made me feel like, okay, this is gonna be a 34-mile run, but I'm, I'm not in danger of being cut off by time or not being allowed to finish or... So that, that was very helpful. 20:32 And when I was training for that, because it required a lot of running, I made sure that I didn't have triathlons in that direct window. 20:41 So my first ultramarathon was in March, and our traditional triathlon season in the Northeast is April through October because of the outdoor water temperatures. Before April, before May, 20:58 water in the ocean or lakes is very cold in the Northeast, so most of them start in April and May. 21:06 And with my ultramarathon in March, I could run as much as I want and as much as I need to without being concerned about not having enough time to ride my bike or not having enough time to swim, because I could use those early, early spring, late winter months to train heavily on the running side. 21:25 And when my race was done, boop, switch, put on my swimming hat and get into tri season. What does rest and recovery look like for you? I am a big advocate for rest. 21:37 The number one way that people get injured in triathlon and marathon training is overtraining. And I don't really have room in my life for preventable injuries. 21:48 [laughs] So for me, in my peak season when I'm training hard for races, I will have at least one or two days a week of no swim, bike, and run. 22:01 Most of my rest days are full rest days, where I'm not doing any kind of workouts. 22:07 Sometimes people have recovery days that have yoga or Pilates or lighter workouts like that, but most of my recovery days are no workouts at all and often include a massage. 22:24 Yeah, a lot of cyclists are on the massage train for sure, like they have them scheduled like every so often, which is probably smart. Totally. Yeah. Which is very helpful. 22:32 In terms of rest, I always tell the athletes that I work with that the way that you rest, like your sleep is as valuable as your training. So I'm very protective of my sleep. 22:44 I don't go out late at night when I have a big training session the next day, and I do try to get at least eight hours of sleep every night. 22:55 It's not 100%, but I do at least try to get eight hours each night, and usually range between seven and a half and nine. 23:05 So on the flip side of this, I, I guess not flip side, but this is complementary to the training and the resting and the working out, is your nutrition, and that's actually something we haven't talked about a whole lot on this show. 23:17 Mm. And the few times it's come up is when people are telling me that they're throwing up in a race. So- Mm... 23:23 I would love to know how you're approaching not throwing up and fueling your body properly, and what does time look like in terms of meal prepping or cooking your own meals? 23:34 How long did it take you to get comfortable eating on the bike and fueling during the run, things like that? Yeah. 23:41 One thing I will say also is, 'cause a lot of times this topic, people feel athletes have to have a super, super strict diet, and I think it's very important to be very mindful and aware of what you're eating, have boundaries, and have nos and this and that. 23:58 But it's not that you can't eat something delicious that you love Ever. It doesn't mean no donuts for the rest of your life, no cheeseburgers for the rest of your life, no chocolate, like whatever it is. 24:10 Like things somewhat in moderation. But particularly when it comes to nutrition and racing, it is something that I started to learn about when I joined Empire Tri Club and was learning... 24:25 Like, I didn't know you eat on the bike before I joined that community. I thought you just eat well before and then just go ride. But that doesn't work when you're riding 40, 50, 80, 90, 100 miles. 24:37 You're gonna be on a bike for six, seven hours burning 700 calories an hour. You gotta eat. I learned a lot from our community. 24:45 We also have, like nutritionists that come in and speak to the club specifically about nutrition, and it's a bit of sometimes trial and error, learning what type of nutrition works best for you. 25:02 There, there are gels, there are chews, there are bars, there are shakes. There's lots of different types of ways to take on nutrition while running or on the bike. 25:17 And then within the different types, there's lots of different brands that make them differently. 25:24 So you have to see what works with you, and then also what you eat and when you eat before these long workouts, 'cause that matters, too. 25:33 A lot of people don't necessarily wanna eat before they work out, or they're getting up too early that they don't-- they're just not ready. 25:41 But if you're gonna be out there, you need to take nutrition before you start these long training sessions. And I have figured out exactly what works for me before I start the workout or a long race, and have also 25:59 fine-tuned what works best for me on the bike and on the run for the marathons. Share with me a little bit about your experience putting together like a support team for some of your longer runs. 26:13 I know for some ultras, people will have people with them that help them carry water, that they can pick up at different points throughout the race, and somewhat as well with longer distance rides. 26:24 Is that something you've had to do so far in your ex- And what has that been like? 26:29 So I am self-sustained because, like some people naturally have supportive communities that can physically come help them with training or at their events, whether that's family, a spouse, a significant other, siblings, cousins, neighbors, office BFFs, what have you. 26:49 Some people have people who are able and willing to be on course with them, and I have an extraordinary support system, but they're not able to be with me during races or in my longer training rides because of life, geography, what have you. 27:07 So I have had to learn how to carry enough water, carry enough nutrition. What are the, what is the right type of carrying device? Is it a belt? Is it a backpack? Is it a vest? Is it this other, like waist pouches? 27:23 There's so many different ones. I have all of them, and [chuckles] I've learned which ones are better for me. A lot of-- The races are also quite good at providing 27:33 s- a good amount of nutrition and hydration, particularly with some of the, like ultramarathons. 27:41 Certain companies, Vacation Races, puts on a lot of ultramarathons that I highly recommend, and some of them are, like beginner-friendly for ultramarathoning. 27:52 And they provided so much nutrition and hydration and aid stations over the course of 34 miles through the desert that I didn't need to bring anything. And like, I was shocked at how much they had. 28:05 I brought my own stuff because I didn't realize they were gonna have that much. But they did have a wide variety. Like, they had run nutrition in terms of like gels and goos and chews, but they also had real food. 28:19 They had soup. They had potatoes. They had cookies and chips and fruit and veggies and-- So that like whatever you needed to fuel you in that long of a distance, they had some very good options. 28:34 And with marathoning, when I'm training for those longer runs, I use a hydration vest that has... 28:41 I think it holds two and a half liters of water, two and a half or three liters, which is a pretty solid amount, and it has a lot of pockets so that I can put other snacks in them, whether it's a gel or a chew or it's a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. 28:55 And I kinda use a combination of both. Yeah. I love that. I think the vests are really popular, and increasingly so for even people who are just not training for anything but just on their regular everyday runs. 29:08 Maybe that's also a southern thing 'cause it is incredibly humid, so [laughs] it is just- Yeah. [laughs]... a necessity maybe for life. 29:15 One of the last things I wanted to talk with you about, because we've haven't shared anything on any specific race reports, though I'm sure you have stories for days on how some races have gone. [laughs] Yes. 29:26 Talk a little bit about your coaching and speaking and what going into that level has been like for you. What was the impetus for you saying, "I want to become a USA Triathlon certified coach. 29:41 I want to give back to my community through speaking and mentoring youth and other athletes and CEO groups through my experience as an endurance athlete"? Again, great questions. I love this conversation. 29:52 [laughs] So I'll start first with coaching 'cause that happened first. Probably towards the end of my second year in triathlon, one of our 30:04 Triathlon Coaches, the founder of our tri club, Allison Kreitewez, approached me and asked me to help coach the beginners, like, the beginner tri group. 30:14 And we have a group, each year we do a 12-week beginner triathlon program to help people get to their first triathlon. 30:23 And it's not a certification thing, it was just, "Do you wanna help out with the beginners and lead some of those runs?" 30:30 And I was really shocked because I was so new to the sport, and I had done a handful of tris, but I didn't feel an expert, and I said that. And she was like, "I'm not asking you to be an expert. 30:42 You don't have to be an expert. You are familiar because you just did this. You just went through the program and you've done five triathlons and a little bit more than next year's class. Almost like a mentorship." 30:56 And she was like, "Why don't you just start with leading some of the runs? 31:00 Like, you, you love to run, you're very familiar with that, you know how things work, and just be available to answer some of those a- preliminary questions that people have, and dealing with some of the nerves." 31:11 And she's, "You just went through this yourself." So I was like, "Yeah, that's a good point." So I agreed to work with the beginners and loved it so much. 31:22 And then found out through her there is a thing, you can become a certified coach and learn more and coach more. And I was like, "Wow, that sounds great." 31:32 So I looked into it and I signed up for the training program and the certification process. And then so I went through all of that, and I think I got my certification originally in 2017 or '18. 31:49 And I completed it, and that was the beginning of my coaching, going that direction and just continually learning more and being able to serve the community and my athletes better, which I loved. Everyone wins in that. 32:06 I'm growing and I share my knowledge, and then the community grows and learns. And when it comes to speaking, after I did my first full Ironman, that was 2019, September, 32:22 I had a very life-changing experience on that journey as through my training and having bike crashes and being hit by a car and recovering and learning how to manage nutrition and balance family life with 15-hour training weeks and eight-hour training days on the weekend. 32:45 And learning all of these things and getting to the start line of that race, which is phenomenal even to get to the start line, and then getting down the finish line. 32:56 And I ran down through the finisher chute which is like a red velvety carpet, and the music is playing loud and it was, it was late at night when I finished. 33:08 They say the party starts after 11:00 PM, like the real party, because those are the final finishers. You have 17 hours to do this race, and the last people come in between 11:00 PM and midnight. 33:20 And so, like, the people who finished early on, a lot of them come back to cheer on athletes. And so I was running down at 11 something, d- having done the most extraordinary physical thing of my life, 33:36 and I got across that line and I was like, "I did... Like, I'm not more special than anyone else. I'm..." 33:45 I go, "I'm athletic because I stay active, not because I'm super strong or super fast or have some special genes, but because I'm active." And I also was very aware when I was 34:02 in that race that I saw maybe as many Brown women that I could maybe count on one hand in that entire race of over 2,200 athletes. And 34:18 I was like, knowing myself and my physical abilities and my history, my background of how I grew up and what I've been through, 34:30 and seeing that I had accomplished this thing that less than one-tenth of 1% of people do in life, I was like, "I gotta share my voice." I was like, "People need to know that this is possible. 34:44 People need to know simply that they can." And like I, I had never done a 10K until Lane told me, "Hey, there's a 10K in Central Park. It's all women and it's a lot of fun. Let's do it." 34:57 I had never done a marathon until Lane did a marathon and told me I could do one, too. And there, there are people living their lives not knowing what's physically possible and what's possible at large. 35:13 There are people who deep down inside wanna become an author but they have no idea where to start, and they may have been told in their life that you don't have it. 35:25 Or they simply may not have been told, "Oh, you can be an author." And... 35:29 Or same to people who have these ideas or wanna start a company or wanna start a restaurant or wanna run a marathon, and they just don't know if they can do it. 35:42 And I, I found it imperative that I immediately shift towards how do I get my voice and my story out, because people need to know that they can do the things that they don't know they can do. 35:59 That's how it started. That is a very interesting statistic. And when you're saying, like, let's even be generous, let's say maybe 10 Black and Brown women out of 2,200 Those four counted That's abysmal. 36:14 That is so small, but it's not because we can't, it's just because we don't. And I'm so glad that you decided, yeah, this needs to change. We need more people that look like me out here. I think that's great. 36:25 So I may have told a slight stretch of the truth. So that was my last question for you. 36:33 But since Mary introduced us, I asked her if she had any questions that would be out of left field for you, so she gave me some questions as well. Okay. [laughs] So her first question 36:44 was, what's the toughest mental barrier you've ever had to break during a race, and how did you push through it? During Ironman Maryland, I'm not a strong cyclist, was not then, still am not now. 36:57 I can swim for days and run for days, but I have to work very hard on the bike. 37:02 One of the reasons that I'm not strong on the bike is because I don't love it, so I do it the least, and I, I say that for the people who are not good at stuff to be like, "You can get better." 37:13 But during that race, one of the hardest things for me was believing that I'll make the bike cutoff, 'cause you have a certain time that you have to make in order to finish the 112 miles on your bike in order to start the run, because they have to open up the streets from the bike course. 37:33 And that plagued me for months leading up to my race, and I knew the cutoffs for months and I trained all my rides in order to be faster than that cutoff, and I didn't know if I was going to make it. 37:50 I did a lot of self-talk to remind myself that I can, and I pumped myself up and talked to other people, and I trained to be faster than the cutoff in my training rides, but it was always cutting it close. 38:04 If anything goes a little bit sideways, then I wouldn't make it. I could not afford that mentally, financially. I'm like, "We paid $1,000 for this race. I've trained for a year." You know what I mean? 38:17 [laughs] I was like, "We're gonna make this cutoff." But I knew that it was a big reality that I may or may not, and I had to believe I was gonna make it, and I just had to work towards it. 38:33 One of the things that helped me was self-talk leading up to and that day. And I was on my bike being like, "Come on, doc, you've got this. Stay focused. You've got this. Pedal stroke after the next, boom." 38:46 You know what I mean? "Stay in gear, lock in, keep going." 38:49 And I also, like thinking about my community and the people who helped me get there, the people, my teammates, Lillian and Bryant, who had been on repeated 80, 90, 100-mile training rides that we did all throughout that summer, and feeling their support and the support of my other teammates that I had trained with for months and months, feeling the support of my coworkers and my boss, Luly McCoy, at the time. 39:16 Like feeling everyone's support was a motivator for me. Like they all believed in me, and I had a choice to believe that I was gonna make it. But that was the hardest 39:30 mental barrier that I had to just keep going and believe I was gonna make the cutoff. In the end... And I cried. I cried a lot on that bike course. Like, I would cry and I'd be like, "What if I don't make it?" 39:41 And then I would cry and I'd be like, "Oh, I'm gonna make it. I'm gonna make it." 39:44 And it was this whole emotional rollercoaster, and I ended up making it to the bike cutoff almost an hour before the actual cutoff, about 50 minutes, which blew my mind, honestly. 39:55 [laughs] I was like, "Oh, I had plenty of time." So yeah, that'd be my, my hardest mental barrier. I love that. We're getting real. You're talking about crying on the bike. We're talking about- It's terrible, girl... 40:04 yourself. [laughs] Yeah. I shouldn't laugh. That's actually very serious, but I'm glad you made it. You did great. [laughs] Thank you. Me too. 40:12 The second and now actual final last question is, if you could pick an athlete to sit down and have dinner with, who would it be? I don't know. I don't know. I'm just gonna, instead of being like, "Let me think," 40:26 I don't know. There are so many athletes that I admire in different sports, and I, not to be a letdown, but I do not have an answer to that. But I am gonna... I am provoked to think about that. Yeah. 40:44 Let's... I don't know. Okay. Well- 'Cause also once I decide who that is, I'm gonna start doing what it takes to make that happen, and that's how I work, how I think. If you wanna do something, do it. Don't... 41:00 Just start taking the steps towards making that happen. And I'm like, if I wanna meet someone, like I've already met several athletes that I look up to. Haven't had dinner with all of them, but have met them. 41:10 Also, 'cause the triathlon world is a small world, the endurance community, so I've met many of the athletes that I look up to because we're at the same events. We go to similar events. We go to similar conferences. 41:22 But who would I wanna sit down and have dinner with? Great question. There's something I'm noticing here about you specifically and also about other guests that I've had on the show, which is this bias towards action. 41:37 Like your statement that you said, "If I name someone, then I'm gonna start doing everything I can to make that a reality." And I think that is very interesting. It's like this can't be theory. 41:48 This can't just be some fantasy, some daydream, some pie in the sky wish, because everything that I think about, everything that I name, I feel like I'm capable of achieving, which is very interesting in a good way. 42:00 I think that is something that the discipline of daily movement and training towards something- Yeah... especially things that challenge you in more ways than one, that brings that out of you. Thank you. 42:14 And yeah, I guess the one last thing that I will say along those lines a little bit is a book called Atomic Habits by James Clear. I don't know if you've read it. 42:24 I don't know if the people listening have read it, but it's a very good book, and it helps you set up simple habits 42:35 that once those things become a part of your daily life, you can move towards what it is, the bigger thing that you wanna accomplish. I'm only slightly obsessed with James Clear. Oh, great. Yes, I'm a part of the club. 42:47 I have the book. I'm subscribed to the newsletter. Excellent. Watched his Masterclass. I'm a little ridiculous. But I agree- Good... 42:53 with a lot of his principles around building habits and doing things that are simple at first, but maybe not easy, which is- Yeah... consistency. 43:02 I feel like consistency is difficult, and if difficult is hard to replicate, then I'm aiming for difficult and consistency. So I appreciate a lot of the things he talks about. So yes, thank you for bringing that up. 43:13 Sure. We'll just add that to the book club here. [laughs] Yeah. So thank you so much for joining me today. I really appreciate it. 43:19 I had a whole lot of fun learning about you and your journey, and I hope someone here today at least tries a triathlon, maybe an indoor, maybe at their local YMCA, or goes out for their first run. 43:29 Maybe I'll go out for my first run. We'll, we'll see. And you could do, take walk breaks as you need. If you run for one minute, walk for one minute, run for one minute, walk for one minute. 43:40 After 10 minutes or 15 minutes, boom, that's your first run, and then build from there. I love it. I love it. There we go. See, she's already got the training plan started for you. There you- There you go... 43:50 the framework is there. [laughs] Thank you. All right, you're welcome. Thanks for having me. It's great to speak with you
